Thursday, February 25, 2016

Lord of the Rings Quotes



Remember that what is right is not always popular, and what is popular is not always right.

12 comments:

  1. All the characters are better in the book, but Eomer especially. He got shoved into the background too much in the movie.

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    1. Yes, same thing with Faramir who in the books rejected the Ring, but in the movies he tried to take it!

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  2. I LOVE this quote! I don't really remember that one but it's now a new favorite. :)

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  3. Hello. Sorry for bothering you, but I saw your two comments on The Council of Elrond's article about the Half-Elven (http://www.councilofelrond.com/middle-earth/the-half-elven-and-their-ancestry/) If you're still confused, I could answer them for you.

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    1. Oh, that'd be great! Haha, you're not bothering me at all :)

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    2. Great! :D Arwen first:

      Arwen went to the same place as all humans. She and Aragorn were together.

      Appendix A:
      “Nay, dear lord,” she said, “that choice is long over. There is now no ship that would bear me hence, and I must indeed abide the Doom of Men, whether I will or I nill: the loss and the silence. But I say to you, King of the Númenóreans, not till now have I understood the tale of your people and their fall. As wicked fools I scorned them, but I pity them at last. For if this is indeed, as the Eldar say, the gift of the One to Men, it is bitter to receive.”
      “So it seems,” he said. “But let us not be overthrown at the final test, who of old renounced the Shadow and the Ring. In sorrow we must go, but not in despair. Behold! we are not bound for ever to the circles of the world, and beyond them is more than memory. Farewell!”

      Arwen dies on Cerin Amroth, where she and Aragorn troth plighted. When Aragorn and Frodo visited there, during the Quest, it says:

      'And taking Frodo's hand in his, he left the hill of Cerin Amroth and came there never again as living man.'

      Never again as living man - so Aragorn came as a dead man, to help his beloved pass over.

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    3. Ah, I see. What do you think about the question of Elros' descendants?

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    4. For the answer of why Elros's children weren't given a choice, I want to go back a step. Personally, I believe Dior was mortal. I follow the "Now all those who have the blood of mortal Men, in whatever part, great or small, are mortal, unless other doom be granted to them"

      We are told in "Laws and Customs of the Eldar" that an 18 - 20 year old elf looks like a seven year old, and that elves don't reach their maturity until somewhere between 50 - 100 years (depending on the elf). Dior married Nimloth when he was 27, was 30 when Eluréd and Elurín were born, and was 33 when Elwing was born.

      Another great example is Imrahil of Dol Amroth:

      At length they came to the Prince Imrahil, and Legolas looked at him and bowed low; for he saw that here indeed was one who had elven-blood in his veins. "Hail, lord!" he said. "It is long since the people of Nimrodel left the woodlands of Lórien, and yet still one may see that not all sailed from Amroth’s haven west over water."
      "So it is said in the lore of my land," said the Prince; "yet never has one of the fair folk been seen there for years beyond count."

      Okay, so why did Arwen/Elladan/Elrohir get the choice and no one else? Putting aside the fact that all three of them chose mortality (see this post of mine: http://theseassong.blogspot.com/2016/02/elladan-and-elrohir-die.html)

      (cont)

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    5. It essentially comes back to the fact that Tolkien sees and writes mortality being a great gift Eru/God bestowed upon humans:

      'Therefore he willed that the hearts of Men should seek beyond the world and should find no rest therein; but they should have a virtue to shape their life, amid the powers and chances of the world, beyond the Music of the Ainur, which is as fate to all things else; and of their operation everything should be, in form and deed, completed, and the world fulfilled unto the last and smallest. [cut] It is one with this gift of freedom that the children of Men dwell only a short space in the world alive, and are not bound to it, and depart soon whither the Elves know not. [cut] But the sons of Men die indeed, and leave the world; wherefore they are called the Guests, or the Strangers. Death is their fate, the gift of Ilúvatar, which as Time wears even the Powers shall envy. But Melkor has cast his shadow upon it, and confounded it with darkness, and brought forth evil out of good, and fear out of hope.' (The Silm)

      In a note to the Athrabeth Finrod ah Andreth, Tolkien says:

      The 'waning' of the Elvish [body] must therefore be part of the History of Arda as envisaged by Eru, and the mode in which the Elves were to make way for the Dominion of Men. The Elves find their supersession by Men a mystery, and a cause of grief; for they say that Men, at least so largely governed as they are by the evil of Melkor, have less and less love for Arda in itself, and are largely busy in destroying it in the attempt to dominate it. They still believe that Eru's healing of all the griefs of Arda will come now by or through Men; but the Elves' part in the healing or redemption will be chiefly in the restoration of the love of Arda, to which their memory of the Past and understanding of what might have been will contribute. Arda they say will be destroyed by wicked Men (or the wickedness in Men); but healed through the goodness in Men. The wickedness, the domineering lovelessness, the Elves will offset. By the holiness of good men - their direct attachment to Eru, before and above all Eru's works (21) - the Elves may be delivered from the last of their griefs: sadness; the sadness that must come even from the unselfish love of anything less than Eru.)

      To be mortal was a gift above all else. It was the 'better' choice. Elrond chose otherwise, but his children still had mortal heritage, so they too could still choose the 'gift'.

      ~*~

      The other reason I personally see, is that Tolkien likes to torture us. ;) We are doomed to have, as Arwen says, "both the sweet and the bitter". Or, as Gandalf says, "I will not say: do not weep; for not all tears are an evil."

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  4. I would agree with you Dior was certainly a mortal since he was the child of Beren (who had always been mortal) and Luthien (who became mortal prior to his birth). Eärendil is clearly mortal as well (leading up to his choice to become an elf and sail into the heavens, of course) as he got married when he was 27 and Elros and Elrond were born just two years later. Also, there was that added peril if Eärendil went to Valinor because no mortal could step foot on the Undying Lands.

    Elrond chose to be an elf and Elros a man. But why did Elrond's kids also get to decide for themselves and Elros' didn't? Perhaps it is because once a mortal, always a mortal. It could be that mortal trumps immortal blood.

    I agree with you, it probably was less of a fact based move by Tolkien and more for the sake of the story--if would be rather less moving if Arwen and Aragorn could easily be together!

    Thank you for taking the time to answer my question!

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